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Vanishing Geometry


DJAB

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Hi Guys,

 

Something for tech to look at hopefully. I have uploaded a fmz file of a model I made. (I am using the maxwell plugin.)

 

iMac 27inch late 2013

3.4GHZ i5

8GB 1600 MHz DDR3

NVIDIA GeForce GTX 775M 2048MB

El Capitan 10.11.3

 

I tried to change the material of the 'slats' which were components, but instead of updating the material, an error popped up for a split second, before I could take note of it formz crashed and over half of the geometry in my model has now vanished. If you look at the uploaded render you can see whats missing, its a huge chunk of work! 

 

Have you encountered this problem before? I'm a new user, I must say this is hugely disappointing. I don't consider this to be a big file... :( 

 

EDIT: I can't upload the actual file, "you aren't permitted to upload this kind of file" so I have uploaded the render of what it looked like pre crash and a screen shot of what it looks like now...

 

I don't expect to get the geometry back but I do need to know what the cause was.

 

Hope you can help,

 

Andy

 

 

post-15766-0-82098100-1475362166_thumb.png

post-15766-0-18533400-1475362271_thumb.png

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Really hard to tell from the screen shot what caused the crash. Just shows the missing geometry. Your back up file .fzb didn't have the old geometry in it?  Are you working with Maxwell Materials or are you just translating normal materials?  I use Maxwell a lot but I do not use components so that may be the issue.  As for uploading the fmz file you need to post a link to a dropbox file that tech can evaluate.

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Andrew,

 

Thanks for the reply, Im new to Formz (and maxwell, this is my 1st time playing with it) so no doubt my model is messy. However, Iv not had any problems like this on any other 3d application, which does make me loose faith somewhat.

 

Anyway. I reinstated the file from Time Machine to get the geometry back and went back over the materials again - which are mixed translations and references. After an hour or so, the same thing has started to happen, its very glitchy and everything is grey.

 

Link to file below. (dropbox is full so Iv copied a we transfer link below). This file is from the time machine back up before problems began to occur. Hopefully tech (or others) can look at this, mess about with materials etc and see if they get the same problems? 

 

On another note, after I re-instated the file from Time machine and changed materials I was getting the maxwell error "scene contains errors, review log for details" and the render would not work, any ideas? if I just re-instate the file and don't change materials I don't get the error and it works okay rendering in maxwell but Fire won't work now, (data process failed) weird!

 

https://www.wetransfer.com/downloads/9c52df936ebb334a2529978845d2e62b20161001235508/e6a25f871944d2a963a29b5cec7662d520161001235508/f7945f

 

Hope someone can help... (or look at the file and give me tips of where Iv gone wrong / what I could do better.) :) 

 

Andy

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Hi Andyb,

 

We have been working with your file for a few hours now without any issues of disappearing geometry.  However, we do notice that some Components that you are using (like the first one in your Embedded Library) have no objects in it.  So if you were to Edit a Component, Select All, Delete, and Save the Component (or choose Component Complete), the that would certainly remove objects from your file.  We also see that some of your Components seem to reference themselves.  This could also cause potential issues, so you should definitely avoid placing copies of the same Component inside its own Symbol Definition (or perhaps we should make that illegal).  

 

We cleaned up your Component Library for you, so you should use this file if possible for best results:

 

file2a.zip

 

Does that help?

 

And of course, if you can ever find any way to cause a problem, or if you have questions whose answers you can't fine, please let us know, we will do our best to help.

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Hi Tech,

 

 

Many thanks for the help. Im wondering if the problems Im having are down to my computer? I know the spec aint great (listed in my original post) but Im really struggling to get going at all. Everything is really slow and glitchy one minute then its fine the next. I really don't know how the components work in formz yet I'll have to investigate that, thanks for the advice. 

 

On to the next problem...

 

See attached screen shot. Any idea why 'window frame' could be greyed out in the objects pallet? (it vanished from being listed in this pallet altogether before I re-opened the file, but the 3d geometry remained on my screen the whole time, although I was unable to click it.) Seams to be part of this 'vanishing' geometry problem that I'm experiencing. (There are no components in this file, just a dwg import, grouped in both layer and object.)

 

:(

 

 

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Hi Andy,

 

Your computer spec is not bad, but you should update to the current version of OS X 10.11 (.6). .  To speed things up, try disabling the Intersection and Key Point (Object) Snaps as these should only be on when being used in general.   Also changing from Shaded Full to Shaded Work will give faster screen refresh rates.

 

If you are just starting out, you might consider just ignoring Components and making copies of objects.  (If you do decide you want a global update in the future, you can always use the Replace tool to do this.)

 

Currently all geometry is embedded in the file, but that shouldn't hurt performance.  The suggestions above should help with that, and if not, please be specific about what is not as fast as you would like.

 

If you want to completely reset your formZ Preferences, Quit formZ, go to the Finder: Go Menu, hold down the Option key, choose Library: Preferences -- and rename the autodessys folder (add a number to the end of the name).  Does that help with the palette issue you mention?

 

Please post a .fmz.ZIP or a JPG file using the More Reply Options (below right from the reply text box) if you need any further help.

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post-15766-0-57195200-1475427226_thumb.pngsee attached screen shot of the greyed out object in the pallet from my earlier post, have you seen this before? 

 

I'm actually having trouble with the snaps too, Im finding that they are hit and miss, and not really accurate to the degree that I require (architectural background, I like things to be exact). If I zoom in, everything is jagged, and the snaps don't work properly. (file set to 3dp) Sometimes the snap is not where my mouse curser is.

 

Im having a bit of a nightmare here!

 
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Andy,

 

In your Object Palette the first Group of DWG objects are Ghosted.  Click the "eyeball" icon to the left of the name to toggle to Invisible -- and then Visible again.

 

If you are talking about the color of the name of the objects themselves, if you right click in the Objects Palette, do you have Show Color checked?  (If so, that is then showing the color.)

 

Snaps should be exact.  If you are having any issues, please post a FMZ.zip file and give specifics of what you are trying to do that is not working so we can help.

 

Have you had a chance to go through the Tutorial Videos yet?

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Hi guys, thanks for the reply.

 

Just to be clear, the object labelled DWG is a DWG file import, that's ghosted, correct. (I want it to be ghosted. That has nothing to do with this issue.)

 

What i'm talking about is the object called "window frame" - the actual text "window frame" is greyed out, and I could not click on the object despite being able to see the geometry on screen.

 

Andy

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I reported the same issue last week  http://forums.formz.com/index.php?/topic/4216-disappearing-parts/.  The Components tutorial video didn't mention not making copies of components.  They always tell you what to do, but not what not to do.  That makes it hard for us newbies.  I also didn't know we needed to turn off snaps unless we were currently snapping to something.

 

I'm also trying a different computer to see which problems are computer related vs. formz related.  For instance on this little windows laptop (14") if I move the formz window to the attached monitor my palettes disappear and won't come back. :angry:

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Hi guys, I'm not talking about the object colour Im specifically referring to the text "window frame" which was greyed out. (As though there is an error in the file).

 

I have attached another file, if you open this in wireframe mode you can see all of the geometry, switch to shaded and you can only see the glass (but still in wireframe), switch to shaded full and you can't see anything. I was working on this file fine until this started happening. I was switching between shaded modes and also turning objects on and off, the object pallet kept on vanishing for a few seconds before re-appearing. 

 

Andy

missing objects.fmz.zip

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Eyeclick,

 

Whats this about the snaps, not something I have came across before, sounds unusual... Tech, can you clarify that?

 

I can't see how I could model without snaps, I would forever be turning them on an off again!

 

Also, I did see your post and actually have already re-installed formz hoping that I had some kind of corrupt installation, but no joy.

 

Andy

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Dear Andy,

 

The Key Point and Intersection Object Snaps can be a bit slow with certain files.  If you notice this, turn these snaps off unless they are needed.

 

You do have the Object Palette: Show Color option enabled -- which controls the color of the items listed there:

 

post-5-0-14417100-1475524885_thumb.jpg

 

Right click in the Visibility Column (with the eyeball) in both the Objects Palette and Layers Palette and choose All Visible to make all your objects visible if that is what you want:

 

post-5-0-62070900-1475524884_thumb.jpg

 

Does that help?

 

And in case it helps further, here is your file resaved after making the objects and layers visible:

 

missing objects2.zip

 

If your palettes are vanishing, or you are having other odd display issues, it sounds like you may be having a video or video driver issue.   We see from your notes in your first post that you were running OS X 10.11.3.  If you update to OS X 10.11.6, you will automatically update your video driver.  We suggested that you do this above.  Have you done that yet?

 

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Hi Tech,

 

object pallet show colour is enabled.

 

I followed your instruction and the geometry came back but why did it vanish even though I had the eyeball set to 'on'. (I thought it was either on, ghost, or off.) All visible refers to the entire file? I don't want to rely on this as there will be times when I don't what to go back and turn everything off again.

 

The problem now however, is that I can't grey these objects out, the eye is fixed 'on'. 

 

To add to this the other layer DWG, is either on or off and can't be set to greyed. You should have the file from my last post, can you confirm the same problems at your end? (see attached, DWG layer set to ghost but nothing showing up.)

 

Thanks

 

Andy

post-15766-0-41699200-1475526087_thumb.png

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Sorry guys, also in the file you uploaded. If you go to the hidden line display you can see that there is some kind of transparency? What could be the cause of this, I have looked in display settings, nothing jumping out at me there...

 

Andy

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Andy,

 

The Mirrored Components are incorrectly showing inside out in Hidden Line display.  Thanks for your report, we will get this corrected.

 

Please feel free to email us directly if you have any further questions.  ;)

 

support@formz.com

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speaking of snap issues I would really love it if the point snaps would go back to the way they were in 6.7.  My snaps only work in 3d views and rarely in a projection view.  So if I wanted to build an architectural facade in the front elevation view and I turn on snap to point (snap on my 2D elevation)  whatever I build is always on the active plane.  The corner point is highlighted in my front view but it still puts it on the active plane.  I then have to move it into place on my elevation.  Then if I go back to my front elevation and try to snap to that objects corner once again the object is on the active plane and needs to be moved again.  Frustrating.  Now for something really weird:  if I cut a hole in my object and then go to the front elevation and snap to the corner of the hole it works!  Totally random.  Snap to face works as it should in every view. 

More weird behavior: If I create a 48" square box on the xy plane and then go to the  front view I can not snap to the corner of my box to create more geometry.  The geometry is always on the active plane.  However, if I create a box on the zx plane in front view and then try to snap to a corner of it the program automatically snaps to the front corner of the object.  So sometimes the program guesses that I want the back corner and sometimes it guesses that I want the front. This seems to depend on what plane the first object was built on.

Getting back to  functionality we used to be able to decide whether we were snapping to the front or back of an object (closest or farthest).  Could we please have that back. Like Siri programs often guess wrong and give bizarre results. This holds true to the texture mapping tool as well.

 

 

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One more thing to note on snaps.  If I create a cube out in space and then go to my front view and snap to a corner of it using DYNAMIC for height the snap to point works perfectly.  However, if I turn off dynamic and type in my height and try to snap to a corner of my object the new geometry is on the active plane again. 

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