-andrew- Posted December 25, 2015 Share Posted December 25, 2015 Hi all, Can anyone recommend a tutorial that addresses creating "soft" seating such as car seats or sofas that have seams, stitching, dimples, etc. such as shown below ? I don't mind using bump mapping for the finer details, but would like to create geometry for the primary form(s). Thanks! Andrew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsiggia Posted December 26, 2015 Share Posted December 26, 2015 The tutorial page on the formZ web site has a "pillow" tutorial that may help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-andrew- Posted December 26, 2015 Author Share Posted December 26, 2015 Hi Joe - thanks for the note! For freeform stuff that looks like a great way to do it. However... for some of the stuff I'm planning on modeling, I need more precision - also the ability to revise some of the "landmarks" that will be used to create the geometry.Still going to experiment with this method though - if nothing else it looks like fun. cheers Andrew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tech Posted December 28, 2015 Share Posted December 28, 2015 Hi Andrew, Take a look at the second tutorial on this page (for the Barcelona Chair): http://www.formz.com/support/downloads/tutorials.html SubDivision modeling may also be a good way to go to generate the automotive chairs you show in your first post. Does that help? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-andrew- Posted December 28, 2015 Author Share Posted December 28, 2015 Well... I guess that's ONE way of doing it! Thing is, I need to modify a lot of these. If the same base shape is the same for the major cushions, I need to be able to draw surface geometry (via imprinting then meshing, maybe?) and mesh it so I can "recess" the features I've drawn down into the cusion by 1" or so (or whatever the depth ends up being...) Hmmm... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew West Posted December 31, 2015 Share Posted December 31, 2015 There are a lot of good tutorials on realistic furniture modeling on YouTube. Unfortunately, they are all using 3DS MAX. The good news is that the method is somewhat transferable to other modeling programs, including Form.z. In Max the method is to mesh a plane or box and then extrude and chamfer segments and points to create creases and seams, bulges and sags. Adding seam segments and additional meshing in areas is easy enough. The only problem I run into in Form.z is the tendency for geometry to become easily non planar resulting in unexpected results and frequent crashes. Hit save a lot. Furniture is hard at first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tech Posted January 1, 2016 Share Posted January 1, 2016 Hi Andrew, Yes, many tutorials for other programs are applicable to formZ as well. In any program you do need to be careful to maintain planarity of surfaces for a number of reasons, but while nonplanar surfaces are not well defined, they should never cause crashes. If you ever find a case where this does happen, please make sure to send it in so we can investigate and correct the issue. And of course, saving early and often is also a good idea in any program... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-andrew- Posted January 1, 2016 Author Share Posted January 1, 2016 Thanks guys. I've just actually posted a question about meshing to try a few things out. As far as nonplanar faces goes, is the best way to handle this by using Triangulate > Non Planar Faces Only once in a while? cheers & Happy New Year, Andrew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tech Posted January 1, 2016 Share Posted January 1, 2016 Hi Andrew, Ideally, if you are working on a base object for Subdivision modeling, you will want to keep all quads, so the best practice is to carefully move the parts and not generate non-planar surfaces in the first place, but non-planar faces can be properly defined by Triangulating them (preferably with the Strict Planarity option). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AHTOH Posted January 1, 2016 Share Posted January 1, 2016 Hi Andrew. I'v spent tens of hours researching what is the best way to model this kind of objects in FormZ. This is what I found out: As for the car seats there is no problem to create this kind of geometry with NURBS or with less presision with Sub D. Going to chesterfield kind of surfaces FormZ would not be my weapon of choice. As it goes to some complex NURBS it becames incredibly slow and buggy. I made a post about it in year 2014 (I guess) in Tutorials by Users. Unfortunately it is buried in time since Autodessys moved to new forum engine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AHTOH Posted January 1, 2016 Share Posted January 1, 2016 Hi Andrew, Take a look at the second tutorial on this page (for the Barcelona Chair): http://www.formz.com/support/downloads/tutorials.html SubDivision modeling may also be a good way to go to generate the automotive chairs you show in your first post. Does that help? Hello Tech.Unfortunately when we are not talking about primitive modeling of this Barselona chair, but something high end standard modeled FormZ is not what can accomplish this task. Or you can prove opposite modeling something like this: http://www.turbosquid.com/3d-models/classic-chesterfield-sofa-chester-3d-model/627521 with the same presision and clariity? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tech Posted January 2, 2016 Share Posted January 2, 2016 Hi Anton, Yes, you can model this in formZ. Will this be an easy task in any software? No, that is a complex model that will take more than $49 worth of your time to create (in any software). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-andrew- Posted January 2, 2016 Author Share Posted January 2, 2016 Morning everyone!Yeah... without really knowing how to do it, I was trying to figure out, based on our discussion here, why you couldn't do it in formZ... I didn't see any particular thing that seemed like it couldn't be handled in formZ, but I am not sure if the tacks (or nails) can be copy/repeated along a path?It's certainly a beautiful model. Last night I started playing around with nurbs (wow/weird), and I'd guess that's a good tool for this kind of thing; I imagine a workflow starting with a very "regular/geometric" model of something like this that is then converted to nurbs. I guess the catch is how, if possible, to keep quads, so you revert/edit the cage? Anyway... thanks guys. Fun stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AHTOH Posted January 2, 2016 Share Posted January 2, 2016 Hi Anton, Yes, you can model this in formZ. Will this be an easy task in any software? No, that is a complex model that will take more than $49 worth of your time to create (in any software). Well, Tech, as I wrote I'v spent many hours investigating it. I insist: it is not possible to do it proper way with FormZ. As model goes more complex the each part movement takes minutes. Unlike what I see in corresponding 3DMax tutorial on Youtube. So, to me is not the matter of effort it is more about tool. What can be easily made with one, could not be done witĥ another. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonmoore Posted January 2, 2016 Share Posted January 2, 2016 I'll weigh in with Anton here and say that FormZ isn't the right tool for the job in isolation. If you look at the Andrews original hero imagery it's plainly evident that a sculpting package will be required too to add the natural folds and creases. The sculpt can then be used as a base for vector displacement to keep the polygon count to a reasonable level (vector displacement can be used with a renderer such as V-Ray). The only DCC packages that I know of that could handle a sofa design like Andrews hero image in isolation would be Modo and Maya, as they both have integrated sculpting tools; and their native renderers handle vector displacement too. This isn't a criticism of FormZ as there's plenty that FormZ can do that leaves Modo and Maya in the dust but in this particular case FormZ isn't the best tool for the job. Even 3ds would require a roundtrip to Mudbox/ZBrush for the sculpt element of the modeling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-andrew- Posted January 2, 2016 Author Share Posted January 2, 2016 I'm currently experimenting with 3D-Coat; I believe this could be handled, or, at least, aided, by something like that. I'm assuming the primary modeling would be done in formZ and then the sculping/texturing would be done in 3d-Coat. Hm... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonmoore Posted January 2, 2016 Share Posted January 2, 2016 I'm currently experimenting with 3D-Coat; I believe this could be handled, or, at least, aided, by something like that. I'm assuming the primary modeling would be done in formZ and then the sculping/texturing would be done in 3d-Coat. Hm... Good route to go with 3d-Coat Andrew. Especially seeing as 3d-Coat has wonderfully simple UV unwrapping tools too (great for creating a dirt mask to mess up your pristine model). The other route I's recommend is Modo Indie, which can be nabbed for 40% off for the next day or so (winter sale), bringing it down from £229.99 to £137.99 (inclusive of VAT). Modo Indie has very few restrictions over the main Modo package, (which sells for close to £1500 (in VAT)) and it includes one of the best native render engines on the market. The offer finishes in just under 48hrs so I'd recommend you download a Modo demo to see how it clicks with you. Modo Indie - http://store.steampowered.com/app/401090? Modo demo & tutorials - https://www.thefoundry.co.uk/products/modo/learn/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-andrew- Posted January 2, 2016 Author Share Posted January 2, 2016 Thanks Jon- Also for the heads-up on Modo. That's something I've been interested in for a while. I have to look to see what restrictions may be in place, though. cheers, Andrew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonmoore Posted January 2, 2016 Share Posted January 2, 2016 Thanks Jon- Also for the heads-up on Modo. That's something I've been interested in for a while. I have to look to see what restrictions may be in place, though. cheers, Andrew These are the Modo Indie restrictions. The main difference is the lack of third party customisation via scripts & plugins and the 100K poly export limit for FBX and OBJ, but neither of these are major in the bigger scheme of things. The most generous aspect is the 4k render limit which is more than enough for most use cases. MODO indie 901 Restrictions: -OBJ and FBX export limited to 100k polys -Bake and render resolution limited to 4k -Command eval options unavailable -Command, scripts, and command history panel results unavailable except “undo” and “history” -Python editor, third-party scripts, and third-party plugins unavailable -Can import all formats, but can only save in .lxf format -Export formats limited to OBJ and FBX -Image save formats limited to .png, .jpg, .tiff and .exr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-andrew- Posted January 2, 2016 Author Share Posted January 2, 2016 Thanks again. Is there a way to show the # of polygons in a model in formZ? Just looked for a while but didn't find anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonmoore Posted January 2, 2016 Share Posted January 2, 2016 As far as I know you can only get global scene statistics via the 'Project Info' dialogue under the file menu. If you're thinking with regards to the polygon export limit in Modo, individual objects should be possible in under 100K polygons with ease and if you're experimenting with the likes of Unity low polygon counts are essential. As an example the leather sofa you posted in your first post would be well under 100k polygons if you convert your sculpt to a vector displacement map (without vector displacement it will be significantly higher). Modo Indie has no limitation with regards to polygon count when rendering within Modo (it will happily deal with 20-50 million poly's), the limitation is only on the export of individual models. A real time architectural render scene in the likes of Unity should be under 250K to run optimally. A typical Vray scene (without vegetation) will be 5-10 million polygons. Once vegetation is involved you can easily have scenes with 100's of millions of polygons (and these are usually handled by external instancing for optimal performance and memory handling). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-andrew- Posted January 3, 2016 Author Share Posted January 3, 2016 Thanks Jon. A sample robot that came with 3D-Coat is about 90k. Thinking about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsiggia Posted January 3, 2016 Share Posted January 3, 2016 For an object, right click on an object and select info. For a project, select project info from the file menu . Joe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AHTOH Posted January 3, 2016 Share Posted January 3, 2016 Hello Tech, hello guys. Tech, I am sorry: you where right it IS possible to create this with FormZ. I did not consider a power of subdivision modeling. Here is how I did that in about an hour. And here is a model Best, Anton. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tech Posted January 4, 2016 Share Posted January 4, 2016 Hi Anton, Looks great, nice work! The Dropbox links you posted above will expire at some point. Is it OK if we repost your FMZ and PDF files here in case it helps others? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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