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vray for FZ - any updates?


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#21 jonmoore

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Posted 20 November 2014 - 01:39 PM

There were suggestions from Autodessys a LONG time ago that a Vray plugin was in the works.  I think this is one reason it is fair to ask how it is coming along.  For my work speed is critical and Vray is an attractive option in that regard.  

 

Not suggesting for a second that the question isn't worth asking with regards to what Autodessys can tell us.

 

Otherwise anything we discuss here is nothing more than conjecture.

 

It interests me that Autodessys have yet to comment in this thread. And seeing as we're in the realms of conjecture this means:

 

a.) They are awaiting to announce something positive with regards to third party rendering plugin availability (subject to finalising current conversations).

 

b.) The have nothing to add to the conversation because there are no ongoing discussions with regard to any new third party rendering solutions.

 

:)



#22 Martin Malinski

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Posted 20 November 2014 - 04:48 PM

As was commented, the Corona poll was started 2012.....it actually states that if any software 'was forgotten'  then ask for it to be included.......(I see no requests for FormZ)

 

We should remember that with the new features in the range of FormZ apps it is virtually a re-launch of the FormZ product. I'm sure that Autodessys are busy trying to facilitate 3rd party development from many suppliers.......(obviously a biggie would be Vray) ......But with the continued support of Maxwell I think Autodessys have it nailed. Anything else is just an extra bonus; a cheaper render option than Maxwell would complete the package ......renderzone <thea, corona> Maxwell, Vray

 

More importantly good implementation of fbx, dae and skp export would open up these and an array of other options.....TwinMotion, Lumion, Indigo ..........et al



#23 Andrew West

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Posted 20 November 2014 - 05:18 PM

Accuracy, speed and budget have always been critical to our entire business.  Unfortunately  they work against each other.  My clients have often demanded the utmost photorealistic renderings for the least amount of money.  The recession made that even worse and it might be years before I can charge what I did in 2006.  When budget allows I try to add as much detail and as many lighting tricks as possible to help make a stunning image that won't tie up my computer for days.  Simply put Lightworks just doesn't cut it on either the quality or the time.  Don't even get me started on the subject of radiosity.  I have had more problems with it than anything else over the years.  Maxwell as we all know has great quality but again at the huge expense of time. Something that has been repeated again and again in these forums.  When I recently evaluated the expense of introducing Maxwell in my office the software was negligible to the cost of setting up and maintaining a render farm so that we could supply our clients with images in any sort of timely manner.  For those of you who know other rendering engines it is laughable how easily you can add simple things like glossiness or displacement materials with minimal impact on time.  The list options in Vray alone  are mind boggling. 

Form.z has done an amazing job of becoming the most flexible and stable modeling tool over the years.  The new build has cut the modeling time in half.  But the bottleneck is and always will be Lightworks.  I don't see that changing any time soon.  As I see it if Form.z wants to ever compete with the big boys they need to do one of two things.  Either get Maxwell to significantly increase their speed or get another render engine that competes with any of the above mentioned.

There is a reason that I have stuck with this company for 24 years now.  But it has been frustrating.


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#24 jonmoore

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Posted 20 November 2014 - 05:43 PM

There is a reason that I have stuck with this company for 24 years now.  But it has been frustrating.

 

Well said Andrew. There's a definite reason a lot of talented folk stick with FormZ, it's just that the journey can be tad bumpy along the way at times... :)



#25 ASONE

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Posted 20 November 2014 - 06:36 PM

It is also about having choice...

 

Plugins

Rhino:  default Rhino, Flamingo nXt, Brazil, Neon, V-ray, Maxwell, Air, Thea, VSR realtime

3DsMax: Default Scanline, Mental ray, Renderman, V-ray, Brazil, Furryball, Finalrender, Fryrender, Arion, Indigo, Maxwell, Octane, Bigrender, Luxrender, Octane

SketchUp:  IRender, ArielVision, Raylecton, ShaderLight, Thea, Bloom Unit, Caravaggia, Indigo, LightUp, LumenRT, Maxwell, Renderin, RENDERLights, IDX Rendentioner, Su Podium, Twilight, V-ray

Revit:  Default, Lumion, Artlantis, Maxwell, Octane, Indigo (beta), AccuRender, 3Ds Max linking

Maya:  RenderMan, 3Delight, V-ray, Holomatix, FurryBall, Octane

 

FormZ:  Renderzone, Maxwell

 

 

Note: some of those engines might be non-photo realistic (I didn't research them all)


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#26 Andrew West

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Posted 20 November 2014 - 07:19 PM

Pretty easy to see a pattern here:

Autodesk is a huge company that has the most pull.  They own Revit, Maya, 3DS Max and a lot of other software.  Millions of user licenses

Sketchup is owned by Google.  No need to explain that. Tens of millions of users.

Rhino is a little bit of a conundrum.  Not sure of their size.

Autodessys:  not sure of their size either but I would imagine under 40 employees. 

I would be interested to know the number of active user licenses there are issued for Form.z versions 6 and newer.  That would help determine the demand for third party software solutions to our problem. 

Chime in any time



#27 Martin Malinski

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Posted 20 November 2014 - 07:54 PM

ASONE,

 

FormZ:  Renderzone, Maxwell

There is also Artlantis native export.....at least up to v7 exports Artlantis v3 ......not sure why its not available in 8?

 

FYI

Revit exports to most of the renderers/3rd party products you name.....they are mostly not integrated.....FormZ could make claim to the same if they sorted out fbx, dae and skp export.



#28 jonmoore

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Posted 20 November 2014 - 07:56 PM

Pretty easy to see a pattern here:

Autodesk is a huge company that has the most pull.  They own Revit, Maya, 3DS Max and a lot of other software.  Millions of user licenses

Sketchup is owned by Google.  No need to explain that. Tens of millions of users.

Rhino is a little bit of a conundrum.  Not sure of their size.

Autodessys:  not sure of their size either but I would imagine under 40 employees. 

I would be interested to know the number of active user licenses there are issued for Form.z versions 6 and newer.  That would help determine the demand for third party software solutions to our problem. 

Chime in any time

 

A little bit of clarity rather than tribal alliances is exactly what's needed here (agree with what you're saying in general Andrew, but in all fairness Sketchup has been owned by Trimble for the last few years) . It's all about numbers. Those companies with large install/user bases have lots of third party options (and Rhino is another product with a huge install base because McNeel have always run extensive open beta programs that give them far greater reach than would normally be expected).

 

In a very good way, Autodessys punch way above their weight, as we're not comparing FormZ with the majority of other CAD offerings. But FormZ has no way of competing with the install bases of Max, Maya, C4D, Modo, Sketchup or Rhino.

 

If you're committing resources to developing a plugin for a third party platform, it makes sound business sense to concentrate on those products that have the biggest install bases. I'm not so sure that FormZ can compete in this area so it's down to Autodessys or a company like Pylon to convince those third party vendors that FormZ is a worthy target for their efforts.



#29 rich f

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Posted 24 November 2014 - 01:05 PM

It interests me that Autodessys have yet to comment in this thread...

A couple bits of history:

 

http://www.formz.com...9778/49977.html

http://www.formz.com...s/16/58732.html

 

They announced prematurely (after much prodding from us users.)

Especially frustrating that there was apparently enough development to get to a beta phase, and then it died on the vine..?

 

I'd expect it is a tough sell to get any third party to take it up for profit potential; it is a bit bewildering to me as to why auto•des•sys can't be that third party themselves in the interest of self-preservation. I suppose resources are not unlimited but imho this is a critical issue for them going forward. I really hope they can gain some traction with V8 and the free version.



#30 jonmoore

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Posted 24 November 2014 - 01:21 PM

Cheers for the context Rich, makes for very interesting reading.

 

It seems that maybe some goodwill bridges have been burnt on either side. Still, it would be useful to get official word from Autodessys on the subject.



#31 3dworks

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Posted 25 November 2014 - 10:54 AM

...or from chaos group! ;-)


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#32 3dworks

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Posted 29 November 2014 - 08:19 AM

and... zzzzz... ...again :D


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#33 ASONE

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Posted 01 December 2014 - 11:36 AM

I wrote Chaos Group and they would not comment...


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#34 jonmoore

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Posted 01 December 2014 - 07:37 PM

I wrote Chaos Group and they would not comment...

I'm on their beta team for both Maya & Modo and they have a policy of not announcing anything unless it's a public announcement. This can be a real pain as they have a habit of leaving you in the dark as to specific aspects of a current betas status (the current Modo beta is Windows only but many of my clients are OS X based so it's important information for them to get an indication of availability for their platform).

 

It's a pain but it's the Chaos way of managing 'the bush telegraph' from spreading misinformation.

 

It's one of the reasons that I was surprised that Autodessys mentioned that V-ray was on the cards a few years back as there was never an official announcement from Chaos Group.



#35 ASONE

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Posted 02 December 2014 - 02:44 PM

As an Apple user I'm used to not knowing anything beyond rumors until a product is released.  At this point I will just wait to be pleasantly surprised.


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#36 Smarttec

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Posted 02 December 2014 - 04:43 PM

Remember the three wise monkeys - Hear no evil, See no evil, Speak no evil does anyone know the power of an NDA?



#37 ingoerik

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Posted 07 December 2014 - 12:44 PM

So Santa has signed an NDA, now thats sad ;) ... so we'll have to wait... and wait ... and wait ... and wait ...


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